32: Psychedelic Confessions with Tricia Eastman

www.psychedelicjourneys.com
www.ancestralheart.com
www.instagram.com/psychedelicjourneys

Iboga
Iboga
Bwiti
MDMA
Ayahuasca
Psilocybin
Peyote
San Pedro
Psychedelic therapy
Rick Doblin
Dr Gabor Maté
Wisdom of Trauma
5-MeO-DMT
Ibogaine
Spiritual bypass
Somatic therapy
Ben Greenfield
Ecstatic dance
Psychedelic integration
Ketamine
Rolfing

Giancarlo: [00:00:00] Hello guys, welcome back to this new episode of the psychedelic confessions today I’m very grateful to have a real truly an expert Trisha Eastman She’s kindly accepted to talk openly about her psychedelic experience For people that didn’t check her previous episodes with us I recommend you do that first But you don’t have to and for people that are here without listening the first episode I will read the bio again Istman is a medicine woman, author, artist, speaker, and [00:01:00] advocate for the psychedelic movement and founder of the non profit Ancestral Heart.

Istman has created a wellness retreat center with thermal hot spring under construction in Sao Miguel Island. Call who in thees to open 2024 ISMAN books, seeding consciousness, plant medicine, and Sensory Wisdom, and the path Transcendence is coming out in 2023 as a medicine woman. Isman has curated retreats in countries where used is legal working F-D-M-T-E, IBOGA for eight years.

She has been initiated into multiple branches of Bwiti, the ancestral tradition from Equatorial Africa, working with Iboga, as well as facilitated the psychospiritual program with Ibogaine and Fibromyalgia DMT at Crossroads Treatment Center in Mexico. Welcome back, Tricia. 

Tricia: Uh, so honored to be here. Thank you so much, Giancarlo.

Giancarlo: Yeah, I’m very grateful about people that accept to come on the psychedelic confessions because you know, it is private stuff. It’s private matter, and, um Usually, you know, not everybody’s [00:02:00] comfortable with vulnerability, but, um, Trisha is, and also vulnerability, as we know, is a very powerful energy for healing.

Thank you for being back. So, As usual, we’d go with the list of medicine, not in any specific order and, um, and yeah, you can tell me what, how was for you the first experience or the most meaningful experience. Let’s start with MDMA. 

Tricia: MDMA was something I started working with, um, when I was in early high school and through my twenties.

And I never really thought of it as something as a healing medicine because I was taking it at raves and, you know, getting crazy. And, um, I had this, uh, experience where I had a traumatic brain injury, um, in my, uh, I was, 27 when it happened and I had, I had taken like a hiatus from psychedelic work [00:03:00] because of a mental illness that my father was suffering and was, was afraid of, you know, dipping my toes back in that water.

And um, I, out of desperation went to the MDMA thinking that it could Um, and had this profound, uh, mystical experience that brought me, um, into the truth of what my real suffering was. It wasn’t the head injury, it wasn’t anxiety, it wasn’t, um, it was, it was me not actually following my soul’s calling. So I literally Um, and, you know, this is funny because, um, now, you know, I talk a lot about psychedelic integration and, you know, one of the things we, we warn people is don’t make any major life decisions for 30 days because you just want to wait for the dust to settle and kind of have a little bit more clarity before you, like, break up with your wife or whatever.

Well, I, um, left my husband. [00:04:00] I left my, I had four houses, I had, you know, a lot of material possessions and I kind of had this like moment like, Oh, I don’t need any of this stuff, you know, and I just need to go find my, my soul. So I went to Europe for several months, um, and, Kundalini, doing Vipassana yoga, doing different forms of meditation, really trying to understand.

Um, who I was and what my, my purpose is. Um, and, uh, really, uh, the MDMA was, uh, the catalyst, which in essence, what I, what I understood from, you know, some of the books that I was reading, um, Was like this Kundalini awakening, which is this understanding of like this vital soul energy that lives in you that, um, was, um, in essence, you know, awakening a part of myself that, that was [00:05:00] my true power.

And, and, um, I have MDMA to thank for that. 

Giancarlo: Amazing. It’s funny because MDMA was legal in Dallas in the 80s for a while, right? Yeah. And couple therapies was using it, um, to prescribe to couple. And they were saying, don’t do anything crazy the next few weeks after having taken. And that’s exactly what you did, right?

But you never, you never regret it. 

Tricia: I didn’t regret it. I mean, it did take me time to kind of actually like leave my husband. I think it was a couple months after the experience, but I had already made the decision right after the journey. I was like, I’ve got to go find myself. I’ve got to do this. Yeah.

Yeah. 

Giancarlo: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I credit MDMA among other things, of course, to keep my marriage together for 15 years because it really helps in looking at the situation from the other person’s point of view. 

Tricia: Yeah. 

Giancarlo: It’s incredible. 

Tricia: Yeah. It’s interesting with MDMA, um, you know, it’s one of the medicines that doesn’t completely, you know, [00:06:00] uh, take, take you off of the default mode network.

So, it doesn’t, um, dissolve the ego, but I think with people who have trauma, um, it’s a very safe place to start, um, and, um, I’ve even found myself coming back to MDMA, um, in later years, um, that it’s really integrative for other psychedelic experiences. So, I’ve had, I’ve had difficult things from initiations that I’ve had to face with And then I, I worked with, with MDMA and it, it kind of integrated those pieces.

So I, I feel like it is a very integrative medicine. 

Giancarlo: Beautiful, beautiful. And I want to take this opportunity for a big shout out to my friend Rick Dublin, who has devoted his life to legalize MDMA. And now we are now on the Last, um, uh, phase of, of, of, uh, FDA approval, hopefully MDMA will be able to be purchased by practitioner as a medicine, uh, next year.[00:07:00] 

Tricia: Yeah. It’s so incredible. 

Giancarlo: Um, ayahuasca. 

Tricia: Yeah. So I met ayahuasca. I read this book, um, plant spirit medicine, and I can’t remember the name of the author. And it talked about all these plants and the spirits. And this was back in, I think like 2009. And interestingly, you know, I had this awakening, um, with the MDMA that, um, had called me to find my true self.

And in that process, I met. My soul tribe, you know, a lot of them were people going to burning man and, um, into ayahuasca and interestingly, um, met this group of people. And I always believe that, you know, unless something’s truly a calling, I don’t go like out seeking it. And so with the ayahuasca, um.

Literally, I’m sitting at the table with this group of people who I, I just really was enamored by because I felt like, wow, these people are, you know, like my soul [00:08:00] tribe. And they said, um, yeah, there’s this Colombian, uh, Taita who is, um, in town, um, and doing an ayahuasca ceremony. Would you like to come?

come with us. And I had read about it happening in the jungles and, um, you know, was even maybe a little scared to make that trick to some strange place with people I don’t know, because I didn’t know anyone else who had worked with it. And so this felt like a safe entry point for me, although like, you know, I know it’s a little controversial thinking about like, you know, how we’re using medicines in the West and being respectful and all of that.

But it was my, uh, Um, you know, entry point into the idea of ceremonial psychedelics. And, um, I had this kind of idea before that going to raves and, you know, using psychedelics in that way that, um, you know, that they’re not for healing, that they, um, you know, this [00:09:00] is your brain on drugs and there’s like the fried egg.

And, um, I feel like. Um, that ayahuasca ceremony turned everything upside down. There was still a lot of things that I didn’t understand that happened in that journey now that I understand. And it, it would have been helpful to have like integration and preparation, but overall I feel like what it left me with was this opening, um, and a deeper sense of trust to continue on my path and continue the work with psychedelics.

Giancarlo: Beautiful. Mushroom. Mushroom. 

Tricia: Psilocybin, um, man, I started doing psilocybin when I was, I think, 16 was the first time I did psilocybin, and the best thing about psilocybin for me Was I could take a little amount and because I had all this trauma when I was really young Um, I definitely had a fear of losing control and so I could take a little [00:10:00] bit of it You know like a half a gram or a gram and I would just get silly You know, like I would start laughing and and you know It was just it felt to me like it Connected me with my joy, my innocence.

Um, and, um, I definitely feel like it has incredible brain repair capacity. You know, the ability of clearing the gut, which is deeply connected to the serotonin in the brain. So I think it’s, um, an incredible treatment for depression and for myself. Um, I feel like I definitely had You know, uh, I, I suffered as a child with ADHD and learned later in life that, um, you know, I was a little bit on the autistic spectrum.

Um, and I feel like my work with plant medicines and even just the calling to go do MDMA at a rave was [00:11:00] me self medicating, was me. You know, in essence, seeking something that was going to, to heal, um, maybe unconsciously without knowing it. And I do feel like each time, even if it was, you know, more in play, um, and more not with that conscious container of intention and ceremony that it, um, helped my brain get to a step further where I could really get clear and, and, you know, uh, interact with life in, in a more healthy way.

Giancarlo: Beautiful, beautiful. But so if, in terms of spirit, you know, like Graham Hancock says that every medicine has a specific spirit and every spirit has a specific personality, what would be the personality of the Sarosavin spirit? 

Tricia: Uh, in, in Mexico, so my ancestors are mestiza and, um, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s definitely a medicine of.

Of Mexico, um, they call it, uh, todos [00:12:00] ninos, which is little, little saints. And so the mushrooms are little children. They’re like little, like I think about like the little toadstool in the Mario brothers, like this little kid that’s super cute and fun and joyful. And that doesn’t necessarily mean that, you know, I mean, the shadow aspect, which is, you know, usually when you take like a heroic dose with the ego death, um, you know, that’s definitely not the feeling of, of a child, but, um, when you enter, after you enter that point into the mystical, I feel like it really connects you to the child within yourself.

Giancarlo: Beautiful. Beautiful. San Pedro. 

Tricia: San Pedro, um, I was first introduced to San Pedro in 2015, and I remember, this was actually my second journey with San Pedro, but I remember being in Mount Shasta with a Colombian, um, And he [00:13:00] served us right under the stars, and it was snowing, it was cold, we were all warm by the fire.

And what I really felt that the San Pedro did was it connected us as one heart. So it was almost like there was a blanket around us, even though it was cold and snowy. Um, I just felt like this sacred connection. And to me, like, like, San Pedro and peyote. As well, and obviously speaking to the respect of, you know, the indigenous tribes and the sustainability sensitivities around peyote.

But, but what I, what I noticed with both of those medicines is, you know, kind of this greater connection to humanity and the human heart and, and how that connects to the cosmos and really the ceremonial aspects of San Pedro passing around sometimes. The medicine drama depends on the tradition because there’s many different ways of working with the medicine, but very common also in peyote [00:14:00] in, um, you know, different ceremony.

There’s this idea of kind of passing around the, you know, I don’t want to use the word, I’ll call it sharing because it’s not like you necessarily become the shaman in the ceremony, but, but, um, you, you are passed. You know, kind of the talking stick, and in that you, you can share a song, you can share whatever’s, you know, useful for the group, and I feel like the medicine just kind of allows each person to see that they can be a conduit for spirit, and it, it’s really like when you get the ego out of the way, that things beyond you that you could never even imagine, like, come through you, and that is the gift of the medicine.

It’s like when you feel something come through you that is beyond you and, um, it’s a power like no other, but it doesn’t belong to you and it is, it is you, but it isn’t you, you know, that is truly the gift of the medicine. 

Giancarlo: Beautiful. Let’s try [00:15:00] to unpack that a little bit. Why is that? Because you feel, you know, you go beyond your personal problem and you feel a vessel for the greater good.

Tricia: Yeah. I mean, in, in like a traditional, I mean, there is no set rules, but in general, in, in the ceremony, when You know, uh, the, the fire is set up and, um, for example, in, in peyote, there’s a very specific direction that you walk around the fire and there’s specific rules of how you connect with the fire, how you connect with the medicine, um, and in some traditions, what songs you sing and when you sing them, if you are aware of those songs, um, and people are obviously Encouraged to learn the songs in, in, in, in the indigenous sense, you know, that’s, that’s part of it is you’re, you’re required to participate and, and all of the work that I’ve done with both medicines have been very [00:16:00] participatory type work, like You know, versus, you know, with ayahuasca, typically you’re laying down on a mat, you’re in your own world, you’re traveling off somewhere, you’re sitting up straight, no matter how high you are, you get scolded if you don’t, you’re connected with the fire, you’re supposed to be connected to the fire because that’s protecting you, that’s helping you, um, you know, burn away whatever you’re releasing.

And, and in that kind of alchemical formula, And the group heart, that’s what kind of creates the vessel for that to come through. 

Giancarlo: Nice. Beautiful. Beautiful. You’re so knowledgeable about all this medicine. Um, CBDV. 

Tricia: So, um, CBD is one of my favorite medicines. Um, cannabis, um, really truly is another miracle of nature in that there are, you know, [00:17:00] so many different cannabinoids that are being studied for different treatments.

Um, CBDV is really interesting because, um, it’s a version of CBD that specifically Um, there’s been tons of research on, um, the brain effects on children with autism. And so I feel like anyone who has neurodivergence, um, it can really help kind of subside some of the side effects and kind of also help with anxiety, uh, inflammation, a lot of, I think, brain conditions that people suffer from are also partially related to brain inflammation.

Um, and then there’s another, um, one that I really love also, um, there’s a company called Rare Cannabinoid Company, and this is the only company I’ve seen, maybe there’s more now, that, um, sell these particular types of, of CBD and THC, and THCV is a non psychoactive TH, uh, version of [00:18:00] THC that works on the body, but it has an energizing effect to the brain, so it actually is kind of like having a cup of coffee without the anxiety.

And, um, interestingly, they found that it also is effective with weight loss. So, you know, most cannabis gives you the munchies. This one does the opposite. It, it, it makes you not want to eat as much. So people can use it for weight loss. You can use it for energizing the brain. And, um, yeah, I mean, they’re, they’re two of the miracles, um, that, that live within cannabis and this beautiful plant.

Giancarlo: There is so many wisdom in these plants. It’s incredible. 

Tricia: Yeah. But 

Giancarlo: so, and what about cannabis in general? It’s a bit of a tricky plant. Again, Graham Hancock says that the spirit of cannabis is the trickster spirit. 

Tricia: Oh yeah. 

Giancarlo: Because it gives you the illusion that it reduces your anxiety. Yeah. But the reality is that the origin of that anxiety Is the withdrawal from the cannabis.

Tricia: Yeah. 

Giancarlo: What was your personal experience with cannabis when you were a teenager? 

Tricia: Yeah, um, for me, I [00:19:00] actually had some genetic testing done because it was cannabis that um, activated my father’s schizophrenia. He grew weed so I remember like my my father didn’t raise me But when I was a teenager and I would go to his house there would be like all these beautiful cannabis plants and this this greenhouse and I remember the energy of it being very powerful like you could feel the ions from the plant You would almost get high, you know off of off of the ions and I think it is a very Sacred plant.

It’s definitely a trickster. It has been a these hooks, you know, where it, it hooks you into continually using it. And in some traditions, um, indigenous traditions, they believe that it can hamper consciousness. So you have to be really careful with it. In some ways, um, it can help enhance consciousness because, you know, it can help you in small doses with specific things for healing.

look at all of [00:20:00] the cannabinoids, um, each of those cannabinoids. Is, um, working on different neurotransmitter systems and things. So it can be really beneficial. But I think what the problem with our cannabis, and I’ll tell you why we have a problem in our society with cannabis, is a couple things. One, it’s disconnected from nature because they grow it in pots under lights.

And it’s the alchemy with nature that makes the plant healthy. It becomes an overly feminized plant. Because it’s grown only with feminine plants, so it’s out of balance. And if you smoke an out of balance plant or ingest an out of balance plant, it’s going to put you out of balance as well. Um, and then I think the other thing is that the concentrations of.

THC and other, you know, psychoactive aspects of the plant have really been genetically hybridized to the point that I don’t think it’s actually very healthy. Um, and I [00:21:00] think, you know, some of these different, um, products, um, such as the DABS and things like that, you know, really it’s kind of like the crack.

of marijuana. And so it’s not good for the brain. It’s the way it’s working on the body isn’t, um, creating balance or like, like supporting the body. It’s actually creating imbalance. So, um, you know, what I’d love to see in the future is, you know, more holistic ways of looking at working with marijuana. Um, and then I think just like really expanding our knowledge base on this plant so that we can know which, you know, like the difference between a sativa and an indica, you know, one is amplifying and energizing, one is more relaxing and, you know, more like journey medicine.

And there’s a lot of like in Colorado, um, especially. Um, but other places where cannabis is legal, there are therapists that are doing psychedelic assisted therapy with cannabis. And I think it could be a powerful [00:22:00] avenue with the right wisdom and knowledge and understanding. 

Giancarlo: Yeah, absolutely. And then there is a group in California, I heard they use it as a sacrament.

They do like only on Sunday in a. in a sacred environment. 

Tricia: Wow. 

Giancarlo: And, um, yeah, also in, um, you know, one of these coffee shop in Colorado, you see that it’s really designed for people to get fucked up. 

Tricia: Yeah. 

Giancarlo: There’s the degree. It’s only the degree of THC. There’s almost nothing. 

Tricia: Yeah. 

Giancarlo: CBD. And, and as you say, there’s, I don’t know how many, Um, active component like hundreds that have not even been completely analyzed and discovered.

So, you know, we integrate the, the plant in the capitalistic model of maximizing sales and that’s what people want by, but, uh, Yeah, I wish that, you know, with legalization, there’s going to be more research. 

Tricia: Yeah, you know, I want to add something that I think is really important. Um, Cannabis is a beautiful plant that has, [00:23:00] in essence, become a prisoner of capitalism.

And that container has created, um, you know, it’s kind of like the same aspect of the feminine and being repressed and not really being able to live in her true power. Um, but I feel the same as for tobacco. Tobacco is one of the most sacred plants used in You know, almost every lineage and every tradition and tobacco as a medicine is incredible.

Nicotine is being used as a nootropic. It’s not addictive. I can tell you from experience and I can tell you from other people that I know that have worked for it. And it’s incredible medicine for, um, ADD, uh, for, um, um, You know, post COVID brain fog 

Giancarlo: ingested, right? 

Tricia: Um, also just a nicotine gum. Like I use this gum called Lucy and you can buy it in like a two milligram dosage or a four milligram, which the four milligram is a little intense.[00:24:00] 

But, um, but it, there’s been some really incredible podcasts with, um, Andrew Huberman of Huberman labs of Stanford. And he talks about how smoking tobacco. or vaping tobacco is harmful and how it affects the body, like, you know, from that perspective. But he says ingesting it, like even in the form of gum, um, actually increases athletic performance and brain performance.

So, you know, again, a very, very misunderstood medicine. And it’s crazy because you think about all these high school kids that are, you know, trying to vape and smoke. And really, I think they’re just self medicating. And it’s like, You know, I feel like the medications that are out there, for example, Ritalin, it’s like the Windows 98 of medicines.

It’s been around forever. We need upgrades. We need new forms of nootropics and things and to really, um, understand the chemistry of the brain. And that’s why, you know, these young [00:25:00] people are, are getting into unhealthy habits with things that should be medicine. 

Giancarlo: Yeah. Beautiful. And, and tobacco for sure.

It’s a master plan. My aunt says the father of ayahuasca. There is. Very powerful ceremony when you drink liters and liters with of water with with with tobacco, which is which has been very transformative for for a lot of friend of mine so we cover a little bit for the meal on the our previous episode, but for for people that didn’t listen to that one and maybe Let’s go a little bit more on your personal journey.

When was your first time? When did you lose the Favemio virginity and how was it? 

Tricia: I never imagined that there was even a medicine that could exist You know to me There’s you know If you think about like this, you know family of all the plant medicines And if you looked at it kind of like a tree like within that tree you would have the Favemio The top of the Christmas tree is 5MEO and the bottom of it is [00:26:00] Iboga.

It’s like Iboga is like the roots of the tree working on the root chakra, working on presence, grounding. Beautiful. Um, and then 5MEO is like the opposite. The crown chakra. The crown chakra. Dissolution. And you need both to heal. And so what I find with 5 MeO DMT is that, um, it really helps, you know, really the core of all addiction, really the core of all trauma, is feeling that we’re not safe.

That we, and, and, you know, in essence, it’s kind of like the story of Adam and Eve getting kicked out of the Garden of Eden, you know, it’s like, I’m not, I’m not supported. I’m not safe. But the minute you have that full disillusioned experience in the way I experienced it, which was under a beautiful oak tree in this like dried up river bed that was in nature and the sun was like.

sparkling through, you know, the branches, um, [00:27:00] as I was returning, but really it’s like just this deep trust in life that, that the design is perfect, that, um, you know, we’re here to learn. This is a school and we’re just learning how to like completely let go, how to be in complete surrender and, um, really just how to stay connected to love all the time.

And that’s the of 5MEO DMT is it teaches. all of those things. It’s just very fast. And, um, you know, I think if you don’t have any background in any kind of lineage of, you know, mystical or esoteric teachings or, you know, any kind of spiritual practices, it’s going to be much harder. It can be confusing.

Yeah. Yeah. It can be very confusing. 

Giancarlo: Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. But, so, uh, now that’s a bit of a difficult question because it’s such a case by case, but you know, if someone who has no experience with psychedelic, what would you recommend to approach [00:28:00] the research with? 

Tricia: I mean, I think five M I’m sorry. Um, I think, uh, MDMA, I apologize ’cause we were just talking about it.

Um, MDMA is. The best starting place because it’s like this loving blanket of like safety and can kind of help you Surrender and let go and kind of know what’s under the hood before you open the container all the way You know before you have that full ego dissolution Um, and then you know, I used to be a little um negative on ketamine, but now I’m starting to see the value if it’s done in a clinic with a really good reputation that’s doing proper integration and proper preparation that doing intermuscular ketamine can be a really good segue because it’s a really safe environment and And, you know, I [00:29:00] have to say the underground network of what’s happening in the psychedelic movement is the Wild West and just to like go in to some stranger and, you know, have yourself basically torn apart, you know.

It can cause trauma to certain people. And so I think, you know, that is a good opening place. That’s pretty, you know, safe, obviously, you know, doing your homework at any time to really make sure that you’re working with the right people. Um, And, you know, San Pedro is such a lovely, gentle medicine as well, you know, because he’s just a gentle grandfather, he’s a master integrator, so he can really help you to integrate things without necessary, I mean, depends on the dosage, because higher dosages, it can actually like, um, usually a psychedelic experience lasts anywhere from six to eight weeks.

To eight hours with like MDMA or psilocybin, you know [00:30:00] how it metabolizes and sometimes you take a booster to kind of extend it to, to eight hours, usually like an hour and a half in like another dosage that is usually half or less than the first dosage that you took, but, um, If you take, um, a high dosage of, of San Pedro, it can last up to 14 hours, kind of like LSD, LSD lasts for about 14 hours.

So, um, you just have to know that there’s a possibility that it could, could have a long effect. Um, and then also with the kind of coming down, because some people, you know, get a little anxious about not being able to sleep at night or, you know, the next day after the experience, if you have something that lasts that long, you just have to know, I might not.

Giancarlo: Yes, but so since you mentioned ketamine and it was not on my list, did you have a personal experience with ketamine? 

Tricia: I’ve had quite a few different experiences with ketamine and it’s interesting. [00:31:00] So I’ve been, you know, looking at Right now the space that we’re in in the psychedelic renaissance is that we have psilocybin and MDMA coming up for legalization, you know, probably next year ish You know, we have Oregon which has you know and Colorado which are going to be launching programs working with The plant, um, and then ketamine is, is legal everywhere.

And so what things can we do in the U. S. that can have an impact on healing and in doing that I really discovered this incredible, um, protocol which is, um, you know, has to be treated with a lot of care, but it’s a combination of ketamine with like deep somatic trauma. body work. And, um, typically it’s done with trochies, which are [00:32:00] like the lozenges, the ketamine lozenges, which is a little lighter than the inner muscular ketamine.

And what I find is that it’s a very beautiful, subtle way because when you’re working with trauma, you want to be in the body, like you want to be with whatever’s happening so you can face it. But it also kind of allows for enough of that surrender so that those things that are deeply. Locked in the body can kind of be moved around and you don’t necessarily close up when when you know You’re kind of releasing that that I call them crystals of trauma It’s like memories that are stored in the body and we all we all have them You know, we all have trauma in our in our physical bodies.

Giancarlo: Yeah, this is so important You know as I mentioned, I’m a big fan of Gabor Matek compassion inquiry protocol And this is based mostly on, on, on somatic integration. You know, where do you feel, you know, using verbal therapy to identify the painful memory and the trauma. And [00:33:00] then where do you feel in the body and releasing from the body and keep on checking with the body.

Tricia: And, 

Giancarlo: and, and yeah, I mean, maybe the third millennia will be the The wisdom of the body, which has been a little bit ignored. But, for example, in your, at, um, at WHO, in the Azores, in your integration protocol, would you incorporate somatic therapy? 

Tricia: 100%. It’s, it’s the, um, I would say the foundation of all of the work that I do on myself.

And the thing that’s really brought everything into integration, um, you know, we as a society, we neglect our bodies and I am guilty. Um, you know, I just recently had a pretty significant injury, which I’ve never had an injury before. And a lot of it had to do with, you know, not conditioning my body and, you know, not, you know, cause when you work with medicine, you’re sitting with people all day long, which is hard.

on the body [00:34:00] and you need to balance that with like physical activity, yoga, movement practice, ecstatic dance, and you know, really in deep diving into the understanding of trauma, how it’s trapped in the body, movement is essential, whether it be through body work, deep, like I love rolfing, which is like a deep form of somatic body work that moves the fascia and a lot of the trauma gets, you know, It gets stored in those tissues, you know, they say the issues are in the tissues, um, and what happens, uh, when you, when you combine that with like low dose, um, you know, like ketamine is it just kind of allows that stuff to kind of come out and when you’re integrating experience, you don’t necessarily need the ketamine.

You can just do the somatic bodywork. And when you do this, this bodywork, what happens is all of the stuff that you kind of confronted in the journey, all [00:35:00] of that is like stored as like acidity and, and, you know, maybe energy in the body and the, the bodywork just kind of is the final sweep that gets the stuff out.

So You know, you have people that you were talking about in the beginning that go to these ceremonies over and over again, and they’re spiritually bypassed and you know, they’re, they keep coming back to the medicine and they also keep having some of the same things coming up in their life. It’s because they’re not actually doing the full step process of preparing, sorry, prep, preparation, integration, and then, um, and in the integration embodiment, proper embodiment practices.

Yeah. 

Giancarlo: Yeah, yeah, I like, I like to call it the, the four Ps, you know, the psychedelic assisted psychotherapy. 

Tricia: Yes, 

Giancarlo: and then the practice of embodiment. 

Tricia: Yes, 

Giancarlo: you know, and sport and, and, and, and also Ben Greenfield was an expert on fitness says that okay, [00:36:00] Diet and movement is key, but then also our body is a battery, so also cold plunge and sonar and, and, and swimming in the sea and bare feet in the forest, so all this embodiment practice, including meditation, I call it an embodiment practice because you go out of your mind.

And then the third P is You know, passion, find your passion that then become a meaning that then become a purpose. 

Tricia: Yes. 

Giancarlo: This is people, you know, sometimes is a bit, um, people feel a bit intimidated because oh my God, what’s my purpose? But it doesn’t have to start with purpose. It can only start with passion.

Tricia: Yeah. 

Giancarlo: Where do you lose yourself? What are the activities that you feel that You channel something else that time goes by 

Tricia: yeah, and 

Giancarlo: that that can become your meaning and then you know like who said that the famous psychiatric the the meaning of life is to finding your gift and the purpose is to give it away 

Tricia: Yes, 

Giancarlo: so but then you know the psychedelic the embodiment the passion the meaning then all this is not [00:37:00] enough If there is not the fourth P, which is people people in community Because that’s, you know, we are social animal.

We prevailed on this planet because of our ability to communicate and interact. And, and, and, you know, when people say, Oh, I don’t care what other people think, it’s like just not true. 

Tricia: Yeah. You 

Giancarlo: do care what other people think. You should not care about people you do not respect and people don’t respect you.

But on your peers, people that, you know, from the, from your tribes, it’s important for you to have their, You respect and, and acknowledgement. And so, you know, that’s why I feel Ibiza is such a special place because it really attracted a tribe with a certain sensibility and, and there is so many opportunity to share meaningful moment here.

So Trish, thank you so, so, so much. It has been incredible, um, time together, um, regarding the psychedelic confessions, all this medicine, I think, are the one of the person with the most [00:38:00] experience in this compound, last few advice for our listeners. 

Tricia: Well, I would just say the, the, what you shared last about people I’ve never like, what a brilliant framework.

Um, I love it. Um, and, and I’m, I’m going to write that down because I think it’s something that should be included and maybe I can, you know, Quote you in our integration materials. I’m always updating them, but, um, when you look at the idea of integration and the experience, the reason integration is important is because you don’t actually know what’s changed within yourself until the world reflects it back at you.

And so the people is the most important part because where your behaviors and where your unconsciousness show up. is in relationships. And so I, I really, yeah, I commend you for, I love your model. Thank you. And so I would just say, you know, again, really [00:39:00] this journey, you know, I think there’s so much in the spiritual space about independence and, you know, becoming enlightened or, you know, finding yourself, but that’s all about you, you, you, you, you as where, um, you know, the people are us and we, and the way that.

This planet is going to evolve to its highest potential, um, which could happen with or without people, hopefully with people. But it’s through us all connecting to each other and collaborating together and really sharing one heart. 

Giancarlo: Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. I feel like I don’t want to let you go, but we’ll, we’ll, we’ll, we’ll do, we’ll do it again.

And we maybe go deeper. on more of the metaphysics and understanding, you know, this archetypal energy for every plant, what you discuss about, you know, the connection between FMEO with the, with the, with the crown chakra and iboga with the, with the root chakra. And maybe we can, you [00:40:00] know, continue with this parallel and, and, and, and look at the Sarasabin with the gut chakra.

And, uh, and yeah, I’d love to discuss more. You definitely have a, Encyclopedic knowledge and, uh, I, you know, your authenticity and passion and, and purs of intention comes through as you know. Thank you very much. 

Tricia: Thank you.

Jingle: Coca zonada, it’s zonada and tea. Coca zonada, it’s zonada and 

tea.